Jason Aaron says "fuck you Alan Moore"

[thefreakytiki]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that the best analogy for Alan Moore is Ty Cobb.


The Tiki

[David]

I find it interesting that Alan Moore gets ragged on so much (and in this case, answering an interviewer's question honestly), yet whenever seasoned industry pros like John Byrne or Frank Miller or Neal Adams say something head scratch worthy, it's met with a shrug.

[Scott C.]

To Mr.s Moore and Aaron,

Shut up and just write your books.

Sincerely yours,
Scott Cederlund

[Wood]

I find it interesting that Alan Moore gets ragged on so much (and in this case, answering an interviewer's question honestly), yet whenever seasoned industry pros like John Byrne or Frank Miller or Neal Adams say something head scratch worthy, it's met with a shrug.

1) They don't command the attention of the modern fan as much as Moore does/should
2) Moore is more apt to speak his mind in a media venue that will get broad reach, whereas those other guys generally mouth off in the comfort of their own environments
3) Usually those other guys limit their comments, as far as I can recall, against the powers-that-be, versus besmirching those creating the books or their fans
4) Miller, Adams and Byrne may be Hall of Famers, but Moore is Michael Jordan

[MarioMuscar]

1) They don't command the attention of the modern fan as much as Moore does/should
2) Moore is more apt to speak his mind in a media venue that will get broad reach, whereas those other guys generally mouth off in the comfort of their own environments
3) Usually those other guys limit their comments, as far as I can recall, against the powers-that-be, versus besmirching those creating the books or their fans
4) Miller, Adams and Byrne may be Hall of Famers, but Moore is Michael Jordan Jerry West

fixed. 

[Jay Tomio]

fixed. 

Would be a sweet logo.

[Dave A]

This.

Aaron's blog post seems like a misreading of Moore's quote:
(emphasis mine)

When I read that, I see Moore talking not about comic writers and artists, but rather the long-time favorite punching bags DC and Marvel. All he was saying is that these big-time publishers should be creating new characters and new concepts instead of constantly rehashing old ones. He wasn't taking potshots at creators, but rather publishers, the same publishers who tend to go on and on about the quality of creative minds they have working for them.

If Kirkman had said it, then everyone would be breaking their necks to pile on the "fuck yeahs!"

Actually though I do disagree with Moore because I think that there are a lot of interesting characters and ideas coming out of mainstream comics these days, but to say that he was insulting creators is, in my opinion, a mistake.

Yeah, this is about right.

Moore might just be raggin' on the real "creators" at Marvel and DC... the editors.

Some quotations from this interview with "writer" Steve Lyons about the recently released Steel #1 (emphasis mine):

When CBR News spoke with the acclaimed British sci-fi writer about "Steel" #1 last November, he gave us details on an entirely different Steel-starring story. But when we checked in with him again to discuss today's release, he promised it wasn't his fault. Well, not really. When he was originally offered the gig, it truly was intended to be a one-shot featuring Steel up against long-time Superman foe Metallo. That all changed when DC brass decided to supersize the story by making it a part of "Reign of Doomsday," and Lyons went along for the ride.

Steve Lyons: "Steel" #1 was originally a self-contained one-shot intended to give some exposure to a slightly neglected character. Then, everything changed, and suddenly I was working on something much bigger.

CBR News: How far along in the process were you when you were told where this story was heading? Or was this your idea? Because when we spoke after the "Steel" one-shot was announced, you told us about a very different storyline. Well, let's face it, you pretty much lied to me.

Lyons: Yeah, sorry about that! What I told you was true at the time, though. I'd delivered a script featuring Metallo, it had been accepted and Sean Chen had begun to draw it. It had even been solicited. It was very late in the day that "Steel" #1 became a part of "Reign of Doomsday," which meant we had to scrap the issue we were working on and start over.

To be fair to the Powers That Decide These Things, I guess "Reign" was conceived as a summer event until someone realized that the "Steel" special, a few months earlier, was the perfect book to launch it in. And it meant I got my second DC commission, which was great for me, even if I might never get to see the first one in print, now.

CBR News: Originally solicited with Sean Chen as the penciler, the book was actually drawn by Ed Benes. What did you think of the superstar artist's illustration of your first DCU story?

Lyons: I loved it. I was worried sometimes, writing this script, that a lot of it was just two strong guys beating on each other -- but, when your brief is Steel versus Doomsday, what can you do? As the pages came in, I saw how Ed brought those sequences to life and made them so incredibly powerful. And then they were colored by Blond and they looked even more amazing.

Really, as a lifelong comic book fan, it's been a dream come true to watch this thing come together.

Someone please explain to me how that sort of bullshit is worthy of anyone's respect, much less the comics G.O.A.T.

[Jeremy G]

There needs to be a best thread category in the 11 O'Closcars. This would definitely get nominated.

This thread is going to have some legs.


 

[Wood]

I see a lot of people reading into what Moore really meant. Yet the quote I referenced doesn't leave much room for interpretation. It's ALL ENCOMPASSING. So are you telling me that the man most of us consider one of the best writers on the Earth, a man who is as meticulous with his choice of words as anyone in the industry's history, is now being excused for dickish behavior because we're assuming he misspoke?

If he meant the editors, he would've said the editors.
If he meant that there are MANY writers who are 1st, middle or bottom tier, he would have said so.

Memo to my brothers-in-arms: It's OK to love a man's work and not excuse his behavior. 

[Dave A]

I see a lot of people reading into what Moore really meant. Yet the quote I referenced doesn't leave much room for interpretation. It's ALL ENCOMPASSING. So are you telling me that the man most of us consider one of the best writers on the Earth, a man who is as meticulous with his choice of words as anyone in the industry's history, is now being excused for dickish behavior because we're assuming he misspoke?

If he meant the editors, he would've said the editors.
If he meant that there are MANY writers who are 1st, middle or bottom tier, he would have said so.

Memo to my brothers-in-arms: It's OK to love a man's work and not excuse his behavior. 

No, I'm not saying he meant the editors... he meant the bullshit writers who let editors write their stories for them. That's the very definition of a hack, I don't care how talented you are.

I don't excuse Moore anything, I've already said he's kinda full of shit in that he built his career on the backs of giants just as much as anyone else ever did. That doesn't mean he doesn't have some valid points.

It's ok to disagree with some things a man says and agree with others. 

[Wood]

No, I'm not saying he meant the editors... he meant the bullshit writers who let editors write their stories for them. That's the very definition of a hack, I don't care how talented you are.

I don't excuse Moore anything, I've already said he's kinda full of shit in that he built his career on the backs of giants just as much as anyone else ever did. That doesn't mean he doesn't have some valid points.

It's ok to disagree with some things a man says and agree with others. 

Again, then why didn't Moore say something to the effect of there are too many writers who let editors write the story for them? He didn't. This isn't a man who doesn't say EXACTLY what he means. This isn't you or I fumbling around with an off the cuff remark that we then look back on and say, "wait, I didn't mean that the way it came out." He was all encompassing about the lack of talent in the industry.

[Dave Faust]

So are you telling me that the man most of us consider one of the best writers on the Earth, a man who is as meticulous with his choice of words as anyone in the industry's history, is now being excused for dickish behavior because we're assuming he misspoke?

Happens to me all the time. Just ask any of my co-workers.  

[VinceB]

Happens to me all the time. Just ask any of my co-workers.  

 

[Dave A]

Again, then why didn't Moore say something to the effect of there are too many writers who let editors write the story for them? He didn't. This isn't a man who doesn't say EXACTLY what he means. This isn't you or I fumbling around with an off the cuff remark that we then look back on and say, "wait, I didn't mean that the way it came out." He was all encompassing about the lack of talent in the industry.

And he went on to say that, specifically, that assessment was based on a lack of new ideas.

If you call yourself a writer and the editor's calling you with ideas for things to work on, I got news for you: you're not a writer. You're a scripter.

Half the creator interviews I read anymore fit that bill. The Lyons one I posted above is just the latest in a long, sad string.

I agree with you, he's saying exactly what he means: modern creators are bullshit because they don't seem to have any new ideas. I've heard that sentiment expressed countless times in recent years on these very forums.

[Kenney]

No, I'm not saying he meant the editors... he meant the bullshit writers who let editors write their stories for them. That's the very definition of a hack, I don't care how talented you are.

I think that's not really fair. Writing a good story, inside of some parameters set for you, is still requires a lot of talent, and writing those people off as hacks seems unnecessary to me. How is that any different than a writer of a television show having to hold to some plot points of the shows larger structure, or get characters from point A to B before the end of an episode?

I just don't see it. Not to mention, editors can be creative folks too, so why is the editor/writer relationship not seen as a sort of collaboration with the more vocal editors?

[Wood]

And he went on to say that, specifically, that assessment was based on a lack of new ideas.

If you call yourself a writer and the editor's calling you with ideas for things to work on, I got news for you: you're not a writer. You're a scripter.

Half the creator interviews I read anymore fit that bill. The Lyons one I posted above is just the latest in a long, sad string.

I agree with you, he's saying exactly what he means: modern creators are bullshit because they don't seem to have any new ideas. I've heard that sentiment expressed countless times in recent years on these very forums.

I have a problem with absolutes. He's saying they ALL are bullshit, and THAT is bullshit. Aaron writes an astounding work each and every month. And frankly the stuff he does, for hire, is largely entertaining as hell too. All Moore had to do was say "most" or "some" or "the majority" and I wouldn't call shenanigans on him.

Either way, just so we don't all lose sight of where we each stand.

Aaron shouldn't have written the column
Moore shouldn't have said what he said

[Farrell]

Alan Moore hates EVERYTHING about comics... The creators, the publishers and the fans. . .

"Everything" about comics includes comics, and he still loves those.  If a novelist hates book tours, talk shows and dealing with Doubleday, that doesn't mean he or she should stop writing books.

[Scott C.]

Aaron shouldn't have written the column
Moore shouldn't have said what he said

This.  

[Wood]

"Everything" about comics includes comics, and he still loves those.  If a novelist hates book tours, talk shows and dealing with Doubleday, that doesn't mean he or she should stop writing books.

But maybe he should stop doing interviews? 

[Farrell]

But maybe he should stop doing interviews? 

Strangely, he seems to like doing interviews.  Nobody ever accused the guy of being modest.