Alan Moore = Such a downer

[deadcowaroma]

Are we talking about power line of the week #8? 

Please refer to the following thread for closure on this discussion:

http://bullpenbulletinspodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=1290.0

[WetRats]

Frank Miller is the antimatter universe Alan Moore: "Nowadays, I'm not planning to make new comics, because I'm too much in love with making movies."

[Wood]

Frank Miller is the antimatter universe Alan Moore: "Nowadays, I'm not planning to make new comics, because I'm too much in love with making movies."

That's probably the nicest thing you could've said about him.

[Dave Wyndorf]

Sorry but I say bullshit to that. If Moore really didn't give a shit, he would just stay out of the spotlight entirely. He NEVER passes up a chance to explain to the world how no one can begin to know how to do justice to his creations. Other than his wife, have you ever heard him speak kindly of someone he's been associated with? He's an ASSHOLE and one of my least favorite people in this business. But I'll still keep buying his funny books.

Now why would you call someone an asshole if you don't even know him? Shame on you! Name caller!
Hey, you're in the public eye now, yourself. How would YOU like it?

[David]

WAYBACK WEDNESDAY!!

[Julian Lytle]

I'm starting to agree more and more with Wizard Moore.

[legion of daves]

how can this guy be a bummer?!  he looks like a blast!

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/dU_1OLwZ8VI&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/dU_1OLwZ8VI&rel=1</a>

[deadcowaroma]

I'm starting to agree more and more with Wizard Moore.

x2 

[Alejandroh]

In my eyes Alan Moore is not this grand wizard. Everything he touches is not gold. He is just a talented juvenile that does not want to share his toys. I don't enjoy everything he has written. Is that because "my intelligence" is not up to par with his. Or maybe it's because I just don't find it enjoyable. I still agree with Wood's original point.

[Adam O. Pruett]

I'm starting to agree more and more with Wizard Moore.

Yeah, me too.

I'm not really going to get deep into it -- but considering what's been done to the man's characters in the name of the almighty dollar, he has every reason to be angry. I'm not saying he's not a difficult person -- he may very well be -- but let's not forget that he's been screwed over by the industry more than a few times.

I mean, for crying out loud -- the man had a contract that said the rights to Watchmen would revert back to him (and Gibbons) once the book was out of print for a time. He didn't know DC never even intended to take it out of print.

When talking about the history of comics, we often sympathize with the plight of the Kirbys and the Gerbers and all the other creators who, at some point, have been taken advantage of... but we forget that those same kinds of business practices (which we condemn) still continue, in certain forms, to this day.

[Wood]

DAP wins again 

I've certainly softened my worldview since this thread originated. I definitely don't think I know the man well enough to say he's an asshole, not sure why I was so vehement back then. I still don't like the way he comports himself and suspect that if I met the man I would still think he's a bit of a pain-in-the-ass. BUT, maybe I'm just more mellow now but I certainly can see the point of "we really don't know him." Because we don't.

Oh, and lest anyone get it twisted, I thought he was the best writer in comics then and I damn sure still think that now. 

[David]

...not sure why I was so vehement back then.

You were so young back then.

[Wood]

You were so young back then.

Ha! I only had two kids!

You know, reading that back, it does feel like a different person. Probably had as much to do with the time (market crashing, economy in turmoil, etc...) as anything that that wild haired looney was saying. 

[legion of daves]

with alan moore, i don't think it's so much WHAT he's saying as it is HOW he's saying it.  everything that comes out of his mouth has such an air of arrogance that it's hard to just listen to what he's saying.   it's like "here, i bought you this awesome cake!   it's a delicious angel food cake.  oh, but one thing, the frosting is made of pure feces, so you gotta get through that first before getting to the actual cake."

[Farrell]

In my eyes Alan Moore is not this grand wizard. Everything he touches is not gold. He is just a talented juvenile that does not want to share his toys. I don't enjoy everything he has written. Is that because "my intelligence" is not up to par with his. Or maybe it's because I just don't find it enjoyable. I still agree with Wood's original point.

Post again after you've poured months and years into something, put your heart and soul into it, and then watched as it was rewritten and repurposed by hacks.

[Tim H]

This is not directed at Alan Moore in anyway, it just got me thinking.   I try my hardest to put the work before the person.  Every genre of art and entertainment, be it comics, music, film or sports has controversial superstars. Sometimes, once you begin to peel back the layers and you get at what makes them tick, you begin to see that you really don't like them as a person at all.   And I struggle with whether or not I should let that influence how I feel about their work.

[deadcowaroma]

Post again after you've poured months and years into something, put your heart and soul into it, and then watched as it was rewritten and repurposed by hacks.

"You know what this movie needs? More bone breaking!"

[Dave A]

In my eyes Alan Moore is not this grand wizard. Everything he touches is not gold. He is just a talented juvenile that does not want to share his toys. I don't enjoy everything he has written. Is that because "my intelligence" is not up to par with his. Or maybe it's because I just don't find it enjoyable. I still agree with Wood's original point.

What does your personal enjoyment of Moore's work or your perception of his attitude have to do with whether or not he was wronged?

I know there's no talking to us comics fans, because we want what we want right now and think it's the creators' responsibility to give it to us or they're giant assholes somehow... but I think there are plenty of characters who have been taken out of the hands of their creators and appropriated by large corporations without having to add to the list with Moore's stuff. Particularly when the use of said characters flies in the face of the intended point and purpose of the original work.

Sigh... I told myself when I saw this thread I wouldn't get into one of these discussions today...  

[Alejandroh]

What does your personal enjoyment of Moore's work or your perception of his attitude have to do with whether or not he was wronged?

I know there's no talking to us comics fans, because we want what we want right now and think it's the creators' responsibility to give it to us or they're giant assholes somehow... but I think there are plenty of characters who have been taken out of the hands of their creators and appropriated by large corporations without having to add to the list with Moore's stuff. Particularly when the use of said characters flies in the face of the intended point and purpose of the original work.

Sigh... I told myself when I saw this thread I wouldn't get into one of these discussions today...  

I suppose I might have just seen this as excuse to rant about him. It's tha nature of the beast though he unfortunately published his story through DC and well business is business and they bein DC wants to mak the most money they can. It's unfortunate for mr Moore to see his creations bastardized. But unless he can somehow wring the rights of it out of DC clutches there isn't a damned thing he can do. His outspoken-ness on the subject just kind of turns me off to that area. If he wasn't making any money from it directly or indirectly then cool complain. But if you benefit let it be. I personally hate the business world and I'm not cut throat at all. Oh well

[Dave A]

I suppose I might have just seen this as excuse to rant about him. It's tha nature of the beast though he unfortunately published his story through DC and well business is business and they bein DC wants to mak the most money they can. It's unfortunate for mr Moore to see his creations bastardized. But unless he can somehow wring the rights of it out of DC clutches there isn't a damned thing he can do. His outspoken-ness on the subject just kind of turns me off to that area. If he wasn't making any money from it directly or indirectly then cool complain. But if you benefit let it be. I personally hate the business world and I'm not cut throat at all. Oh well

I know what you're saying, and I get put off by whiny writers whose books get turned into movies and then they don't like the movies, too. But the difference with those guys is, they have the choice. If I create a comic -- a comic, by the way, which is intended as an exercise in exploiting the medium of comics in ways that cannot be done in any other medium -- and then everyone completely misses the point and just wants to see Rorschach kicking people's asses "for real", and the movie gets made completely against my will, I might have a few choice words myself. Sad but true: if Moore were to independently produce new material featuring the characters in Watchmen, he could be (and probably would be) sued for copyright infringement.

Fact is, while it may seem like sour grapes to many, it's not really about the money. DC was willing to pay, and Moore refused the money (or rather, made sure it all went to his co-creator on the project, Dave Gibbons). He just didn't want the movie to exist, because, again, it flew in the face of why he wrote the book in the first place.

Also, DC is in the legal right in this situation, but, as with 99% of these cases, not in the moral right. Not that it makes a difference, they still retain control and make their gobs of money off the work of a guy who basically hates their guts, but it doesn't make them less of a pack of jackals for it, or Moore (or any of the other hundreds of creators this has happened to over the years) any less wronged.