11 O'Clock Comics Episode 179

[New Mutant]

New Hawkman continuity. It doesn't get awesomer than that.   

Oh NOOÔOOOOÖŒOÔOOOOOOOOOOÓŌŌOŌÒOOOOOOOOOOOOOOØOØØØØÔOOOOOOO.....!!!!!!!!

[JimN]

New Hawkman continuity. It doesn't get awesomer than that.   

I've barely read any Hawkman comics over the years and yet I've always been curious about the character so I'm seeing this as a fresh chance to finally give a Hawkman series a try. I hope it's good. Honestly, based on what i've seen so far, I'm a bit trepidatious.

Jim

[Rustyautoparts (Russ Otto)]

I'm a bit trepidatious.

Nice word!

I agree with you. I'm not a fan of Tony Daniel's writing. I like Philip Tan as a cover artist, but I find his storytelling muddled at best. I'll let you guys test drive it. I hope it's good!

[JimN]

Nice word!

Thank you, sir!

I agree with you. I'm not a fan of Tony Daniel's writing. I like Philip Tan as a cover artist, but I find his storytelling muddled at best. I'll let you guys test drive it. I hope it's good!

I hope so too. We'll see...

Jim

[ThePatheticClub]

I'll let you guys test drive it. I hope it's good!

I'll do the same...

[valance_the_hunter]

Another great show you guys.  I have to say thanks to Chris for the heads up on Blast Furnace, been catching up on it all day and its been cracking my ass up.   

[leafinsectman (Dan)]

For those wondering, my son won the election! 

That's fantastic! Congrats to your son!

By the way, I watched some more of Regular show and I'm kinda mad (not really) that you guys didn't mention it sooner. That show is hilarious! Yeyyyyuuuhhhhhh!

[David]

DC Comics: Bad at Math

[Chris]

DC Comics: Bad at Math

GOD SAVE THE CHILDREN!
















Kids don't and won't read comics in the numbers we want them to.

[Planck length]

Kids don't and won't read comics in the numbers we want them to.

again 3 dollars for 22 pages (or less) or an episode of Young justice in HD

which is a kid more going to like?

[Julian Lytle]

DC Comics: Bad at Math

You know why that comic isn't funny to me. Because the Starfire in that show was NEVER like any Startfire in the comics. Neither was Terra. Neither was Raven. I remember when that show first came on, I was a camp counselor and I had kids between 7-19 reading comics every day all summer. None of them cared show being the same as the comic or really didn't even want to read that book (most of the time this was before the Johns reboot). That comics reads like a fanperson wrote it from a fanperson's perspective.

GOD SAVE THE CHILDREN!
Kids don't and won't read comics in the numbers we want them to.

Maybe. Maybe not. First they need to know they exist.

Now unlike others later today I'm going to get some comics in kids hands.

FREEWAY RICKY ROSS OF COMICS BITCHES!

[whirlwindx]

DC Comics: Bad at Math

I guess the cartoons and movies should always override the comics then.

[steve bryant]

GOD SAVE THE CHILDREN!
Kids don't and won't read comics in the numbers we want them to.

Why does it have to be an either/or proposition?

It may be true that kids will never read comics in the numbers that they used to, but that that argument shouldn't be used to justify creating misogynistic superhero comics with female characters that function as little more than sex dolls.

If mainstream superhero comics dealt with mature themes in a more sophisticated fashion, the material could function on multiple levels and appeal to a broader, more inclusive audience.

It's wrong to look for kids/tweens/teens to replace the current audience; they should supplement it.

[JimN]

Why does it have to be an either/or proposition?

It may be true that kids will never read comics in the numbers that they used to, but that that argument shouldn't be used to justify creating misogynistic superhero comics with female characters that function as little more than sex dolls.

If mainstream superhero comics dealt with mature themes in a more sophisticated fashion, the material could function on multiple levels and appeal to a broader, more inclusive audience.

It's wrong to look for kids/tweens/teens to replace the current audience; they should supplement it.

Well said.

That webcomic wasn't about kids reading comics anyway. It was about a kid watching a TV show (Teen Titans) based on comics, getting older, becoming nostalgic and then trying a comic with her favorite Titans character in it only to find that character had been reduced to little more than an adolescent male fantasy.

For anyone unclear on the concept, imagine growing up thinking Batman was cool, trying your first Batman comic and in the comic, Batman's little more than a swimsuit-clad, promiscuous sex object for female readers and you'll get the picture.

[Chris]

Why does it have to be an either/or proposition?

It may be true that kids will never read comics in the numbers that they used to, but that that argument shouldn't be used to justify creating misogynistic superhero comics with female characters that function as little more than sex dolls.

If mainstream superhero comics dealt with mature themes in a more sophisticated fashion, the material could function on multiple levels and appeal to a broader, more inclusive audience.

It's wrong to look for kids/tweens/teens to replace the current audience; they should supplement it.

Yeah, like Twilight.

[Julian Lytle]

Well said.

That webcomic wasn't about kids reading comics anyway. It was about a kid watching a TV show (Teen Titans) based on comics, getting older, becoming nostalgic and then trying a comic with her favorite Titans character in it only to find that character had been reduced to little more than an adolescent male fantasy.

For anyone unclear on the concept, imagine growing up thinking Batman was cool, trying your first Batman comic and in the comic, Batman's little more than a swimsuit-clad, promiscuous sex object for female readers and you'll get the picture.

To me at 7 Batman was Adam West. He had a dope house, a whip, dope ass pole to a dope ass basement and a sidekick who had catchy phrases. This was the same on Superfriends.

I then saw this Dark Knight Returns in the Waldenbooks and opened it up and started reading and real talk it was weird. Ronald Regan was in it. Superman was a douchebag. Batman was mean and Robin was a girl.

That had little to no effect on me and comics or the character.


The first time I read Catwoman in a comic she was on the track as a prostitute and I was 10. I got it from the library (Year One).

Neither was that cool to me, cool Batman was B:TAS. Again I don't know if comic  Starfire is the best example of this. She was always half naked. Always a bit to open with her sexuality to me. She was never that Cute, girl next door exchange student that was on that show in the comics. I read mad of those 80s Titans books. I read mad amounts of her Titans appearances. Maybe the biggest mistake in the new 52 was them not making her the cute, nice girl from another world still trying to get used to earth cultures.


Oh and we need kids to keep this thing alive Chris.

Also superheroes are really for kids, it's at it's best when it's treated as such.

One Piece.

p.s. I had to drop that in.

[VinceB]

One Piece.

p.s. I had to drop that in.

STRAW HAT PIRATES FOREVER! 

[steve bryant]

Why does it have to be an either/or proposition?

It may be true that kids will never read comics in the numbers that they used to, but that that argument shouldn't be used to justify creating misogynistic superhero comics with female characters that function as little more than sex dolls.

If mainstream superhero comics dealt with mature themes in a more sophisticated fashion, the material could function on multiple levels and appeal to a broader, more inclusive audience.

It's wrong to look for kids/tweens/teens to replace the current audience; they should supplement it.

Yeah, like Twilight.

Twilight is no more representative of all content written for the tween/YA audience than Stan Lee-scripted Spider-Man issues represent the sophistication of all comics.

Twilight clumsily touches upon mature themes, but Cherie Priest, M.T. Anderson, Rick Yancey, J.K. Rowling, Suzanne Collins, Rick Riordan and a number of YA authors have, as well. And they've handled the content far better than Winnick (Catwoman) and Lobdell (Red Hood) did.

[New Mutant]

... imagine growing up thinking Batman was cool, trying your first Batman comic and in the comic, Batman's little more than a swimsuit-clad, promiscuous sex object ...

[TimmyWood]

Not really feeling like getting into another dick measuring contest this morning, particularly because JimN is always a positive and calm contributor to these boards.  I went back and re-read the comic in question this morning on the way to NYC and:

1) As was pointed out on the show, the neck thing was just a visual cue I was mis-reading b/c of her hair
2) I still think the car is drawn incorrectly, the left side lacks the right width
3) The stripper looks like she just flew in from Somalia

BUT...most of the panels are tighter than my comments would have suggested. In a 20 (22?) page book, to have a few things that struck me as particularly wonky, but to have the rest be technically proficient, rock solid stuff, I definitely can see how my comments were overly harsh.  Credit it to being exhausted from the having to read another 13 books in a few hours time and be able to (try to) speak intelligently and critique them. At that point in this cycle, it was becoming either a "love it" or "hate it" kind of modality, and that's not fair to the creators.

Did I like the book? Not at all. And while I think Chang's efforts were some of the weakest of the bunch this week, I was too harsh (which was Jim's point initially).

And to Jim? Listen, my Scottish hackles got up last night and I was needling you unfairly. Having just (re)visited your art blog, I'm sure you took my declaration vis-a-vis our respective artistic eyes as an insult, and that's not one of my finer board moments.  Those recent sketches (particularly the Koi) are pretty awesome stuff. And I apologize for being a dick yesterday. Won't be the last time I'm sure, but you deserved more respect than that.

Peace.

Woodrow

This made me proud that we share a last name. Mad Karma.