$3.99 price point...will WE show Marvel it's a bad idea?

[Wood]

Wood, first, with all due respect, my post, though it used your name, was not directed only at you. It was for everyone reading, but I used your name because your last paragraph stated simply that you weren't going to buy the $3.99 books, therefore, effectively boycotting the price jump. Bob clarified his position, so I apologize for including him.

However, about your original post, quite frankly, there isn't a conclusion about whether or not it will work. Your primary point is that comics=addiction, comic buyers can therefore be price gouged. We will take the kick in the wallet because we are addicted and if you don't stand up against that, it's the buyer's fault, so they have no basis for complaining. Moreover, your post seemed to be railing against comic fans who say one thing and do the opposite, condemning those you might be trying to appeal to. 

Rather than point out the ineffectual act of not buying certain books, I tried to point out a way that real change could be enacted. There is no way, none, that the comic buying community will stop buying books completely. There is no way (and I wish I was wrong on this, but I know I'm not) that comic fans will ever agree on one topic enough to make a change occur through an act of singular resolve.

To complain about the price of books is understandable. To worry about the health of the industry is also understandable. To outright declare:

...is really just creating a preemptive rant against the arguments you foresee happening. This doesn't do any good and just causes derision.

What I propose is that we actually try and talk to someone at Marvel. I don't know anyone myself, but I'm sure someone in the comics community knows who to talk to. One of the podcasts like AC, iFanboy, CGS, or WordBalloon may even have the pull to try and get that person to talk in a recorded interview. If not, one of the news sites could do a write up. Let's find out exactly why they say the price is going up. Let's ask the real tough questions and not sit back letting the decisions be made without at least a bit of transparency. Without the real answers, everything is supposition.

I don't disagree with the sentiment of what you're trying to say. The feeling of paying more in this time is ridiculous. However, how we go about making arguments is just as important as the argument being made.

Karma. I think you're right. I am, in part, anticipating the wave of "those fucking $3.99 books!" only to be followed by those same people saying, "Hey, did your read Hulk #12, WOOT!" And that is, preemptively, annoying to me. I also sadly agree that no matter how rational an argument is made to avoid or seriously curtail your purchase of books at that price point, most will cave.

[deadcowaroma]

Karma. I think you're right. I am, in part, anticipating the wave of "those fucking $3.99 books!" only to be followed by those same people saying, "Hey, did your read Hulk #12, WOOT!" And that is, preemptively, annoying to me. I also sadly agree that no matter how rational an argument is made to avoid or seriously curtail your purchase of books at that price point, most will cave.

I agree that the complaining about $3.99 books probably does no good, but I don't see the harm in doing it. I'm all for people complaining about whatever they want. Power to the complainer!

[Chad (Grilled Cheese Sandwich)]

Karma. I think you're right. I am, in part, anticipating the wave of "those fucking $3.99 books!" only to be followed by those same people saying, "Hey, did your read Hulk #12, WOOT!" And that is, preemptively, annoying to me. I also sadly agree that no matter how rational an argument is made to avoid or seriously curtail your purchase of books at that price point, most will cave.

Karma back...I see the same thing happening and have heard the complaining and anticipating across podcasts for a couple years...it sucks...but...

I agree that the complaining about $3.99 books probably does no good, but I don't see the harm in doing it. I'm all for people complaining about whatever they want. Power to the complainer!

...I don't disagree that everyone has the right to complain. The big thing is sticking to the point and understanding the root cause of the complaint. If we're all mad at Marvel for charging $3.99 for books, is it because of the price, or is it because we are willing to pay that price? So, (hate to go psychological/philosophical, but here it comes) aren't we really mad at ourselves for enjoying something that we know is not worth the money but indulging anyways?

Complain away...and enjoy the complaints...just know what we're complaining about...that's all...

[Dave A]

That is what puzzles me most. Ok, we know their crap about needing more money per issue is just that, but lets act as if its the truth.......... Why not 3.25, 3.50 0r 3.75.

I am personally buying into the theory that it is to kill indies.  I think they know most comic readers have a comics budget and will buy their MARVEL/DC books  then with the leftover look into the indies. Nobody buys Blue Beetle or Spidergirl so putting out more Marvel/DC booksdoesn't work to take our excess money. Charge us more for what issues we do buy and gamble that we will keep buying them seems to be the plan, then we will have no money left over for indies.

So this is the "screw you, Robert Kirkman!" theory?

I really, really, really doubt this. Since Marvel is a business, probably the normal business considerations go into pricing their books, including "What will the market bear for this product?" It's probably a mix of "how much will people be willing to pay for this?" and "how much will we have to charge for this to make our money back on its production?"

Why $3.99? Probably because we've been shown by companies like IDW that people will pay it. Would I rather see the more popular indie price point of $3.50 -- or no increase at all? Absolutely. But if enough people will pay $3.99 for Wormwood to keep it profitable, why wouldn't you expect enough people to pay $3.99 for Black Panther or whatever to keep it profitable?

Anway... I would be incredibly surprised to hear that Marvel was subtly issuing a fatwa on indies, especially since they mine so much indie talent.

[clever_username]

I also sadly agree that no matter how rational an argument is made to avoid or seriously curtail your purchase of books at that price point, most will cave.

If only Marvel would put out a really disappointing event that would sour me on a whole bunch of $3.99 books. That way I would never cave. 

[Radioactive Man]

If comics make me happy why should I stop buying them.   That is the way I look at it. 

[BobBretall]

If comics make me happy why should I stop buying them.   That is the way I look at it. 

I totally agree with this point.  No one should stop buying a book they love and feel is WORTH the price it is charged because it gives them (in their opinion) that $ amount of entertainment value.

Which brings me back to the point that I'm going to cut the books I get marginal enjoyment out of and don't feel warrant the higher price.

[evaD]

If comics make me happy why should I stop buying them.   That is the way I look at it. 

Good point. Here's a tangent. I really enjoy reading comics. A lot. Big surprise there, right? I buy more then o few of them each week and look forward every week to reading what I buy. However, I have a limited budget and have a hard time deciding what to get. Now the company that I have followed most closely for most of my life is leading the charge to increase prices at a time when prices for everything else is dropping. Not only that but there isn't a real clear reason for the raise and it's a rather large increase. Because of this I will have to cut books from somewhere and I'm pissed about that. Further, I feel the only rational place to cut from is the offending company. Not because I think it will teach them a lesson or anything (although I wish), but because it seems the most logical to continue supporting good books I can buy more of. It would feel wrong to chop books I'm enjoying that haven't increased in price, or where I know the money is more appreciated (i.e. independent books). I also find it a little ridiculous that a 22 page comic will cost about  50% of what a paperback novel costs. But really that's beside the point.

[Matthew S.]

Well this is an interesting topic for me because I dont buy any single issues. Also, I buy many used trades on amazon marketplace. I purchase plenty of trades new through amazon, B&N and IST. The price on single issues doesnt impact me much at all. I probably only buy about 10-20% of my books from marvel and dc. However, the differences I have noticed are on something like the big oversized Marvel HC's are normally $5 more than they were a few years back. Also DCs prices on their hardcovers means that I dont even consider them when buying. $24.99 for 6 issues of Superman out of the thousands of Superman issues. I dont really get why those particular 6 would be worth a hardcover at that price.

[Chad (Grilled Cheese Sandwich)]

If comics make me happy why should I stop buying them.   That is the way I look at it. 

That is exactly the point. Comic fans won't stop buying books they like. So, you've essentially, simply, answered the subject question in this thread. No, we won't show Marvel it's a bad idea. Or rather, so few will, that it won't make a difference to anyone but the LCS owners...

It would feel wrong to chop books I'm enjoying that haven't increased in price, or where I know the money is more appreciated (i.e. independent books). I also find it a little ridiculous that a 22 page comic will cost about  50% of what a paperback novel costs. But really that's beside the point.

I believe the same way...especially about the possibility of paying $.32 a minute (if an average comic takes about 12.5 minutes to read) or $.18 per page. Ridiculous. Talking about paperbacks...if I read The Stand in paperback, the most recent edition has 1141 pages for $8.99, that means I'm paying $.0078 per page!!! A less lengthy book, say American Gods, in paperback, has 624 pages for $7.99, that means I'm only paying $.013 cents per page...

Granted, I don't get a series of pretty pictures on every page, but I do get a hell of a lot more story...and I can create the pictures mentally...

However, the differences I have noticed are on something like the big oversized Marvel HC's are normally $5 more than they were a few years back. Also DCs prices on their hardcovers means that I dont even consider them when buying. $24.99 for 6 issues of Superman out of the thousands of Superman issues. I dont really get why those particular 6 would be worth a hardcover at that price.

And of course, the first available edition is always the hardcover, with at least another six months wait time for the trade paperback edition...

The only reason for this, to get optimum money from trade waiters...a completely opposed business plan from Image or Vertigo...and Vertigo's a part of DC....I don't understand!!! Well, I do...but it annoys the hell out of me. For DC & Marvel, they have the history and that tradition equates to the crack cocaine of comics...highly addictive and easily accessible...everyone knows Batman, Superman, Spidey, etc...and because of their rich history, we remember these characters from our youth, in one form or another, and we pay for that...they are nibbling at our bank accounts due to nostalgia...

[evaD]

That is exactly the point. Comic fans won't stop buying books they like. So, you've essentially, simply, answered the subject question in this thread. No, we won't show Marvel it's a bad idea. Or rather, so few will, that it won't make a difference to anyone but the LCS owners...

I believe the same way...especially about the possibility of paying $.32 a minute (if an average comic takes about 12.5 minutes to read) or $.18 per page. Ridiculous. Talking about paperbacks...if I read The Stand in paperback, the most recent edition has 1141 pages for $8.99, that means I'm paying $.0078 per page!!! A less lengthy book, say American Gods, in paperback, has 624 pages for $7.99, that means I'm only paying $.013 cents per page...

Granted, I don't get a series of pretty pictures on every page, but I do get a hell of a lot more story...and I can create the pictures mentally...

And of course, the first available edition is always the hardcover, with at least another six months wait time for the trade paperback edition...

The only reason for this, to get optimum money from trade waiters...a completely opposed business plan from Image or Vertigo...and Vertigo's a part of DC....I don't understand!!! Well, I do...but it annoys the hell out of me. For DC & Marvel, they have the history and that tradition equates to the crack cocaine of comics...highly addictive and easily accessible...everyone knows Batman, Superman, Spidey, etc...and because of their rich history, we remember these characters from our youth, in one form or another, and we pay for that...they are nibbling at our bank accounts due to nostalgia...

I think what bothers me the most is how quickly and extremely comic prices are going up. Over the past 8 years comic costs have more then doubled the rate at which my salary has increased. If that rate continues I will not be able to buy any comics in another 8 years. I'll be completely priced out of the market.

[David]

WAYBACK WEDNESDAY!!

[Doug!]

WAYBACK WEDNESDAY!!

You sure?  I could have sworn this thread was new. 

 

[David]

You sure?  I could have sworn this thread was new.

Out with the old, in with the new?  Like mesh shirts, bell bottoms and nut huggers; it's a topic that's still in fashion.

[VinceB]

Gah.

 

[Dave A]

I'm glad we all banded together and then stuck to our guns to effect positive change in comics. Discussions like this one show how much we as fans can really make a difference.

[JimN]

I'm glad we all banded together and then stuck to our guns to effect positive change in comics. Discussions like this one show how much we as fans can really make a difference.

You sarcastic dog...

Jim

[David]

Gah.

I know.

I went with this one because I didn't want it to seem like I'm picking on DiDio or Kirkman yet again.  But I have my eye on a bonus Wayback Wednesday for today.

[steve bryant]

As a Marvel-only monthly reader, I am really disappointed in the price hike.  When you look at the value for your dollar, it's really hard for me to justify $4 for the content.  I mean, that's nearly $50 a year per book for 12 issues.  And maybe it's just the way I personally consume comic books, but I'm much less likely to reread a monthly than I am a collected edition.

This is a great time for you to get rid of that "Marvel-only monthly reader" tag and try some great books like Hellboy, BPRD, etc from a smaller company that cost less—not to mention the fact that Dark Horse's books are printed on much better paper stock than the shit that Marvel uses.

EDIT: I didn't even realize that it was a Wayback Wednesday thread (the "New" label on the main page added to my confusion). But I stand by my comment.  

[Gabe Infinity Watch]

The change in prices that Marvel, DC, and Vertigo have made just makes me love DCBS even more