11OCC Episode Archive

[David]

Actually, the banging the head emoticon and the how do you argue with that line is more directed to Chris' remark about filing for the same sex marriage license- I probably should've quoted that directly... so there you go, Mr. Price...

That makes sense.

And BTW, that sample looks AWESOME... I know as I'm trying to get myself back into drawing, acuna is one of the guys I'm looking at these days...

That, not so much.

[VinceB]

That, not so much.

You am a Philistine. Off with you head!

 

[Jefferson]

I miss this place!

and we miss our resident rock star!

[Sausage King]

Sorry to break the flow of this thread, but I am new here, and am pretty sure this is the episode in which I heard Chris Neseman say that he has never looked at an issue of Previews. Considering some of the comics I have heard him discuss, I find this to be amazing. Dark Tower must be one hell of a retailer. Where I purchase my comics on a weekly basis they order very few issues of anything that wasn't pre-ordered by a customer. They try to not have anything left at all to put into back issue bins. As an example, the most recent example anyway, they only ordered one copy of Hellboy:The Crooked Man, and that was because I pre-ordered it. Had I not used a Previews I would not have even known about it. I have just started using DCBS, and even with that I have to peruse the Previews. I guess all I am saying is that I kind of wish I lived in Chicago!

[tomkaters]

Darktower is pretty sweet. I have looked in previews exactly once...and that was because I wanted to see what it is like. Mark keeps the store pretty even. About 1/3 of the store is indy stuff...and he gets some obscure stuff.

[Wood]

Sorry to break the flow of this thread, but I am new here, and am pretty sure this is the episode in which I heard Chris Neseman say that he has never looked at an issue of Previews. Considering some of the comics I have heard him discuss, I find this to be amazing. Dark Tower must be one hell of a retailer. Where I purchase my comics on a weekly basis they order very few issues of anything that wasn't pre-ordered by a customer. They try to not have anything left at all to put into back issue bins. As an example, the most recent example anyway, they only ordered one copy of Hellboy:The Crooked Man, and that was because I pre-ordered it. Had I not used a Previews I would not have even known about it. I have just started using DCBS, and even with that I have to peruse the Previews. I guess all I am saying is that I kind of wish I lived in Chicago!

Welcome aboard Sausage King! I've got to agree with you. The fact that Chris is so knowledgeable and well read, and has such a propensity to read and experience non mainstream books, I'm baffled that he's done all that without ever reading Previews. Mad props to my co-host with the most as well as his LCS.

[Peter]

Concerning the Ape/Radical comparison that we also discussed over on the CGS boards:

You guys answered Wood's attempt to compare the two in the discussion that followed: Radical is a start up company with an admitted cache of funds and an easy access to the backdoor of Hollywood. Ape is a small press that lives off of the base of their product and is in the business to make comics first and foremost. It's a no-brainer that Radical has more room to take chances with their product. Their creator line-up alone speaks to that as Vince mentioned as well as being able to sell their product with ad support and such.

So sure - Radical made a great move. But they are an unknown. For all we knew, it could've tanked. And the content from both companies are also very different, their target audiences are different, and the formats are different.

It's apples and oranges on a lot of levels.

[Peter]

Chris is so right about putting Karl Kerschl on the Flash. He did issue 3 of the Bart run and I was like "WHY ISN'T HE THE REGULAR ARTIST!". He actually put thought behind using his art in a good way for a book about a speedster. I liked his stuff before that but this was the issue that made me a fan. He's awesome. It seems like DC wants someone with a unique feel to their art: Arcuna, Williams II. So why not Kerschl. Good call Chris.

And Arcuna on Freedom Fighters rocked. It's the artistic spiritual starting point for his current Eternals book. Great stuff.

[VinceB]

Karma to the Rios for caring.

[Chris]

Darktower is pretty sweet. I have looked in previews exactly once...and that was because I wanted to see what it is like. Mark keeps the store pretty even. About 1/3 of the store is indy stuff...and he gets some obscure stuff.

Yup. Mark is the best. I don't need to read previews because I know that DT is probably going to have everything I want. Sometimes he'll sell out, but all I have to do is ask him to get another copy, and it's there in the next couple weeks.

I is spoiled.

[Peter]

Chris - did Darktower once go by the name of Watchtower?

When I was in Chicago back in 2002 I went to a comicstore in Chicago kinda under an elevated subway line. The loop? Anyway - I have a business card that says Watchtower.

[Wood]

The Rios stepping into the 11OC forums!

Karma.

And Peter, I agree that Ape and Radical are apples and oranges. My issue is that I think Ape puts out some quality stuff and I think, whether it's inevitable or not, they put themselves behind the 8-ball with that pricing strategy. It's so darn hard for small press books to gain an audience as it is, putting a $5.99 price tag on something all but guarantees people will skip over it unless they have reason to already look for Ape Entertainment product.

[Chris]

Chris - did Darktower once go by the name of Watchtower?

When I was in Chicago back in 2002 I went to a comicstore in Chicago kinda under an elevated subway line. The loop? Anyway - I have a business card that says Watchtower.

Yup. The confusing history of Dark Tower is as follows.

Opened up at a location on N Western around 2002 with two partners.
Partner 1 hires Mark to be the manager and buys out partner 2.
Store moves down the street into Lincoln Square and shares space with a specialty DVD store and changes name to Dark Tower.
DVD store loses lease in up-and-coming area and Dark Tower moves back up the street a few doors down from their old location.
Mark buys out partner 1 and it's been roses ever since.

[Peter]

Chris - Thanks!

Wood - I guess the next thing I would question is your definition of "people" when you say they'll skip over something. You referenced looking through Previews and ordering online. No way are those people the average comic readers. That's a hardcore reader.

Someone who casually walks into the store, picking up books on the shelf. Or those that may even have a pull-list but only because of being exposed to books at the store itself - that's the majority of readers out there. So if you're talking this second camp - sure. I can see that. But if you're flipping through a comic rather than just reading a cold solicitation, I think there's a greater chance that someone would pick it up regardless of price point because the content is there to see. I think the greater factor is the content itself. Fiction Clemens is nothing like the Radical books. Nothing at all. Regardless of price point, if you like one over the other, it's a sell.

[Matt Kramer]

Yup. The confusing history of Dark Tower is as follows.

Opened up at a location on N Western around 2002 with two partners.
Partner 1 hires Mark to be the manager and buys out partner 2.
Store moves down the street into Lincoln Square and shares space with a specialty DVD store and changes name to Dark Tower.
DVD store loses lease in up-and-coming area and Dark Tower moves back up the street a few doors down from their old location.
Mark buys out partner 1 and it's been roses ever since.

You forgot partner 1 runs off with the copy of FF #48 that I was going to buy!   

[Wood]

Chris - Thanks!

Wood - I guess the next thing I would question is your definition of "people" when you say they'll skip over something. You referenced looking through Previews and ordering online. No way are those people the average comic readers. That's a hardcore reader.

Someone who casually walks into the store, picking up books on the shelf. Or those that may even have a pull-list but only because of being exposed to books at the store itself - that's the majority of readers out there. So if you're talking this second camp - sure. I can see that. But if you're flipping through a comic rather than just reading a cold solicitation, I think there's a greater chance that someone would pick it up regardless of price point because the content is there to see. I think the greater factor is the content itself. Fiction Clemens is nothing like the Radical books. Nothing at all. Regardless of price point, if you like one over the other, it's a sell.

I'm actually saying neither of those!

Most comic readers don't look at Previews. We agree. And that's a MAJOR problem for indie publishers. That's a huge reason why things like Dynamo 5 and Proof and Atomic Robo and Red Mass for Mars are selling a few thousand copies. No one even knows they're out there.

So since the percentage of people even LOOKING for indie books is that low, I would hate to see a company alienate those few who DO look at the back of Previews. It's that old adage, if you walk on the lot, you want to buy. If someone has the devotion to comics to pour over the back of Previews, they likely want to experience at least a few small press books each month. I'm saying that, all things being equal, since all you have to go on is the solicits, a $5.99 book is a lot less likely to be bought on a whim than a $1 book.

[Scott C.]

since all you have to go on is the solicits, a $5.99 book is a lot less likely to be bought on a whim than a $1 book.

Really?  Personally I avoid the $1 books generally because a)I'm not that interested or 2) the $1 or even the 0 issues tend to be more fluff than story.

Radical at least did it right by presenting a full book for $1 but other than that, what really set them apart from anything?  When I'm looking at the back of Previews, I'm wanting a concept that grabs me much more than a price point.

[AZN_FIST]

Really?  Personally I avoid the $1 books generally because a)I'm not that interested or 2) the $1 or even the 0 issues tend to be more fluff than story.

Radical at least did it right by presenting a full book for $1 but other than that, what really set them apart from anything?  When I'm looking at the back of Previews, I'm wanting a concept that grabs me much more than a price point.

I hate to agree but you've got a point there. I've seen some of those artists on DA (deviantart) and I'm glad Radical picked them, but I think Niles' story might be worth checking.

edit:Herc's been good (I read the issues from the LCS) but someone's gotta brighten those friggin color tones! Agh, it's too muddy.

[Peter]

When I'm looking at the back of Previews, I'm wanting a concept that grabs me much more than a price point.

Now that I read that, I agree with that. Sure - price point has kept me away in some cases because of reaching my budget - but content is much more a factor. Which is why Calibre just seemed like an awesome concept to me.